Yesterday, RNZ radio broadcaster Susie Ferguson interviewed Juliet Moses, spokesperson for the NZ Jewish Council, following the controversy at the Hui on Countering Terrorism and Violent Extremism in New Zealand on Tuesday, June 15.

How many need to be involved to create a terrorist risk?

When discussing the 2018 rally where attendees showed their support of Hezbollah, Susie Ferguson said (2m 30s):

“When we are talking about a rally, that makes it sound really big, I understand we are talking about 20 people, that sort of number, that’s correct isn’t it?”

Thus she implies that because such a small number of people were involved that the Jewish Community was making a mountain out of a mole hill.

To even think this way, suggests that she doesn’t understand the dynamics of a terrorist threat, despite the fact that the Mosque Massacres demonstrated that an act of terrorism can be perpetrated by a single individual, radicalised through their own personal journey, without any formal connection to an organised terrorist organisation.

If one single individual can cause so much harm, tragedy and loss of life, how much more harm, tragedy and loss of life, can twenty something individuals do, if they got together and got organised.

But wait, the fact that they were at a rally showing their support for Hezbollah, showed that they are already getting together, and getting organised…

Terrorism doesn’t respect geographic borders

When Moses cited a Hezbollah bombing that killed 85 in Buenos Aires in 1994, Ferguson cuts in, saying (3m:

“But we are talking about what’s happening in New Zealand here.”

She implies that terrorism acts and terrorism track records overseas don’t count.

But terrorism respects no geographic borders, as the Buenos Aires bombing shows, and as the Christchurch Mosque Massacre also demonstrates.

Calling out a organisation of Muslim terrorists doesn’t mean all terrorists are Muslims

In fact, in the Christchurch Mosque Massacre, not even the passage of time seemed to matter as the perpetrator cited Muslim invasions of Europe that occurred centuries ago, and they occurred overseas.

Strangely, Ferguson seemed to hold the idea that Moses’ comments conflated Islam with terrorism. She asked Moses if this was so. Moses responded by emphatically denying it.

In an interview the previous day with Andrew Little, the Minister responsible for the GCSB and NZSIS, Ferguson said Moses had declared that all Muslims were terrorists (1m50s).

When Little challenged her and said “I’m not sure that that was what was said,” she backtracked and restated her question as “the effects of her [Moses’] words, is that what was in effect what was being said here.”

A position which Andrew did not support in his reply. In fact he went on to say that later over a food, the two groups had a constructive conversation and the matter was smoothed over.

A well-meaning mistake?

It seems like she is trying to protect the Muslim community from some hideous tropes, but in doing so, she unwittingly undermined much of the good that the hui could have inspired. Instead, she has undermined the legitimacy of the Jewish community’s anxieties.

You can listen to the whole interview with Juliet Moses here:

And here is the interview with Andrew Little:

Here is an interview with Abdur Razzaq, the Federation of Islamic Associations of NZ chairperson, who led the walkout.  In it, he complains that Islam is being securitized, that is, terrorism is being conflated with the religion, and claims that Hezbollah is not a terrorist organisation, but a resistance movement:

NZFOI